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Sunday, December 11, 2005
Ignoring What Others Say About Your Church Leadership
Rick Warren has a fascinating quote that I'd like to share and discuss a little today. Here's the quote:
"When you're small, they'll dismiss you; when you're growing, they'll criticize you; and when you're large, they'll resent you. So ignore 'them' and get on with whatever God has told you to do!"
Ahh... don't you love it when other church leaders talk about you and your church? It could be another pastor in town; maybe another pastor in your conference or denomination; and, in these days it could even be a blogger writing about an experience they had at your church.
Church leaders, just like every other profession, love to 'talk shop'. That's a big part of this blog: talking about ministry matters with other ministry people. We like to talk about what's happening in the ministry world; what's working and what's not; who's growing and who's not; you know... 'ministry talk'.
But what is said when we talk is important. Rick points out three different groups in this quote: The small church leader; the growing church leader; and the large church leader.
The "Small Church" Leader
How many times have we dismissed churches (and their leadership) totally based on their size? In reality, half of all churches have less than 100 adults participating; one one-fourth have 50 or less. So, truthfully, the majority of all church leaders will serve in small or very small churches for most or all of their career.
I've been in the room with small church leaders and large church leaders when the issue of size comes up. It gets touchy real quick. The small churches' biggest complaint: no one will come along side of us; no one will help us; no one will support us. In Rick Warren's words: The larger churches 'dismiss us'.
Let's face it; Christianity Today and Leadership Journal are filled each issue with writers from either large or growing churches. Many of the articles included at this blog are from a similar group of growing and large church leaders. Why is that?
I think the biggest thing you'll find as a small church pastor or leader is passiveness: people don't talk about you: you'll often be dismissed and overlooked.
The "Growing Church" Leader
When your church is growing, Warren says, people will criticize you. They'll criticize your methods; your theology; and you personally. While I find that many growing and large church pastors dismiss the small church pastor; many small church pastors are full of criticism of the growing and large church pastor (this is just a personal observation).
If you don't believe this, check out just about any post on this blog. This blog has more than it's share of critics! :) And the biggest thing that people like to pick apart here (and everywhere): growing and large churches. Criticism abounds. Pastors and church leaders, just like everyone else, love to pick apart everything.
I love to talk shop. But I hate undue criticism. And it seems that it's hard to have a ministry conversation without someone slamming someone else. It happens all the time. Always.
Warren says if you are growing, you will be criticized. Nuff said.
The "Large Church" Leader
When your church is large, Warren says, 'they' will resent you. (Who is 'they'? Church leaders!) Rick is a prime example of this. There is a good sized group of people who abhore any large church (and thus, large church leader). Many have taken swipes at Rick Warren for all kinds of things. There are websites and 'ministries' that are determined to bringing Rick Warren down and educate all the unsuspecting followers about the truth about this evil man. Don't get me wrong, Rick Warren is not perfect... being a man and all. But he's highly resented by some. If he gives back his entire salary to the church and tithes 90%; some criticize the 10% he lives on. On another post we had on this blog a couple weeks ago, Rick Warren said he had to repent because of his ignorance of the AIDS epidemic. Some said he should have repented years earlier. This, in my opinion, surpasses criticism and moves into the area of resentment.
I don't wish the life of Rick Warren or any other large church pastor or celebrity on anyone. Every thing you say and do is documented. When you're on Larry King; there's a transcript; your life is a stage. And if you slip up even once; some people are unforgiving. Rick's point is well taken: people will resent you.
So, why even discuss this?
Well... for one reason; and it's found in the last part of his quote:
"So ignore 'them' and get on with whatever God has told you to do!"
If you're a small church leader; put aside your feelings of being dismissed by others. If you need help from a large church in your area, ask them for help; but stop being angry with them for not offering. And above all... get on with whatever God has told you to do!
If you're a growing church leader; the temptation to read every review and criticism of your ministry will be huge; but it won't necessarily be beneficial. It can take the wind right out of your sails. Ignore the criticism. And get on with whatever God has told you to do!
If you're a large church leader; the resentment from other church leaders can really sting. Just think if you were Rick Warren and Googled yourself to find point by point theses on how your ministry is wrong and how you are personally an abhorant leader. Don't even go there. Instead, get on with whatever God has told you to do!
I think Rick's advice is something that each of us, no matter which position we find ourselves in this morning, can take and use today.
Chances are, you will be criticized today. Get over it and get on with it!
Have a great week!
Todd
FOR DISCUSSION: Do you find Rick's quote to be true? If you're a small church leader, do you feel dismissed, etc.? How do you best deal with what other church leaders say about you and your ministry?
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Comments
Todd,
In my opinion--this was one of the best posts EVER on this BLOG...and that's saying a lot b/c there has been some good stuff here.
I needed this--I wished I would have had it five years ago. This is so true--when we were small there was hardly anyone who took an interest in us. We were the "cute" church where all the young people went.
Then we began to grow--and it seems that recently the critics have came out of the woodwork. Never mind that we are seeing hundreds of people come to Christ each year--in their opinion the way we are doing it is wrong.
And I have to be honest--that bothers me--BAD. And I am so tempted to begin to debate with them...but it would be fruitless and would accomplish nothing.
I can either...
A. Debate with people who I can't win with anyway
OR...
B. Reach people for Jesus.
I will go with B...understanding that in doing so I will have my critics--hey, Jesus had them--why should we be any different?
And once again--thanks for this post...I don't know if it spoke to anyone else--but you get an AMEN from this brother from another mother!
Posted by: Perry | Dec 11, 2005 9:49:14 PM
Finally, someone says it like it needs to be said. Rick Warren is right on with this.
Thanks for sharing, Todd.
Posted by: David Russell | Dec 11, 2005 11:02:23 PM
Good post. I think we forget when we are criticizing leaders we are criticizing God's church. I'm under the impression that peaople critisized the way Jesus did things as well. I must confess, I have been guilty of being critical at times as well.
It was said to me once when I was being critical about the way someone was doing ministry,(healing), that when Jesus spit in the dirt and made mud for a blind man's eyes, people probably said, "that's not how you do it!"
Do what God asks is always the right choice no matter what the critics say.
Excelent article.
Posted by: Ed Mooneyhan | Dec 12, 2005 12:37:54 AM
Good post Todd, his statement is very true.
This is something I had to learn this past year is to turn a deaf ear to garbage like this.... Let'em talk.
Posted by: Evangelist Jeff | Dec 12, 2005 8:13:51 AM
Indeed criticism for a pastor is like advice--lots of people are willing to give it but most of what we're given is worthless. But like advice, we all need some criticism from time to time--accountability, the prophetic word. The question I struggle with is the question of discernment. How do we sift out the critical or resentful or dismissive voices but not close ourselves off to those who may be speaking the truth in love.
Posted by: Andy Mangum | Dec 12, 2005 8:39:31 AM
Andy, Good question? I don't know everything but I can tell you this. I always know that people are going to hurt me before it happens.
Posted by: Evangelist Jeff | Dec 12, 2005 8:53:43 AM
Want to know something ironic? In a few months, you can bet that MMI will come out with an article saying that it's dangerous to ignore the critics because you're closing your mind to potentially helpful advice, etc. A good rule of thumb: the more the criticism irritates you, the better the chance that it's right.
Posted by: Tom | Dec 12, 2005 9:18:52 AM
Todd, one point for you and others (like myself) is that you don't necessarily have to be the senior pastor to be the subject of criticism. I've seen many posts here slamming you and others for your simple opinion. Really, people!
Truth in love is a mile from a critical spirit. Thanks for the grace I've seen you show time and again on this post when you are put on the defensive. You have been a blessing to me!! Keep it up!
Posted by: Kim K | Dec 12, 2005 9:31:08 AM
If you think you're dismissed when you're the pastor of a small church... how about if you're an "assistant pastor" at a small church!
It's very easy to base one's actions on what is hoped will eventually earn respect, rather than a "well done" from the Lord we serve.
However, I think that we (I) sometimes are helped by thinking about the question, "Why do I feel dismissed?" This may simply be pride, but it may also be a need to step up to a new level of leadership.
Ken
Posted by: Ken | Dec 12, 2005 9:31:26 AM
I like to refer to the "Saddle Principle" when this issue of accusations is discussed. I tend to hear those that are "in the saddle with me" when it comes to constructive criticism. I work a lot in missions, and have had folks who don't give a dime to world evangelism with all kinds of observations about how I should be doing my job. Their stuff tends to go in one ear and out the other. On the other hand, when someone is by my side in the work, has experience in what I do, understands what I do, and has earned my trust by friendship over time and proven love - - well, I'm a bit more ready to hear this person that is or has been "in the saddle" with me.
Posted by: Mark Simpson | Dec 12, 2005 9:32:41 AM
This is a great posting. If we are all working for God, then why should we resent other leaders. What I often see is people complaining who are not willing to do the work to be successful.
Posted by: Pat Spelling | Dec 12, 2005 9:34:23 AM
"By this all men will know if you are my disciples, if you love one another." John 13:35.
"Love is patient, love is kind, love does not envy, love does not boast, love is not proud, love is not rude, love is not self seeking, love is not easily angered, love keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices in the truth. Love always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. Love never fails. 1 Cor. 4-7
"Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one who loves Me. He who loves Me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him too and show myself to him." John 14:21
"(Our)attitude should be the same as that of Christ Jesus." Phil. 2:5
May the LORD bless you all today and may we each become more like Him today so that we may bring joy to His heart and turn others from a life of rebellion to a live of service to Jesus! PTL!
Posted by: Steve Belokur | Dec 12, 2005 9:44:57 AM
Great post! I've definetely experienced this type of criticism. at times I've been guilty of it myself. I'm new to the ministry and am serving as a pastor in a small church. In our community there is a large and growing even larger church that gets alot of attention. Even people from our own congregation have made comments of interest in attending this other church. Now, I think it's a great church. Wonderful pastors and great ministry. However, because of their size, they do have resources available to them to attract people in ways that a small church does not have. That's where I think alot of the criticism comes in. I serve at a wonderful church that loves it's people, preaches the gospel and cares for people's needs, but we are losing people to this bigger church. It's a tough thing to experience, and it does create some animosity: Even though, personally I have great respect and love for the leaders of this other church. I see that alot of the growth of this other church is transfer growth. And it's mostly because they can offer bigger and more attractive programs. I hate to use this illustration, but I have none better to compare. I know that big churches are totally well-meaning, and their hearts are likely in the right place, but it's sort of like a Wal-Mart coming into a community. I know that's going to make some people mad, but is it too far from the truth. We've got to do something to make sure that the little guy in town doesn't have to close it's doors because the supercenter church offers just enough of everything to draw people in!
Posted by: Andy | Dec 12, 2005 9:48:26 AM
I've heard different versions of this story, but it goes something like this:
On one occasion D.L. Moody was criticized for his mass evangelism methods, and he replied to his critic, "I don't like them either. What methods do you use?" When the critic indicated that he didn't use any, Moody said, "Well, I like the way I do it better than the way you don't."
I've worked in both big and small churches (I'm in a medium-small church now), and I've seen it from both sides. I didn't always like the methods, but at least they were out preaching the gospel and reaching people. It's up to God to judge their hearts beyond that point.
Posted by: Jeff M. Miller | Dec 12, 2005 9:51:10 AM
My husband and I have been pastoring a small church in an extremely unique cultural area within a mountainous region of the US. We encountered many obstacles in bringing this church from being inward focused to outward focused. We were not too proud to solicit intercessory prayer and assistance from other churches over the past year because we knew this fledging church and us could not reach the city in the region alone. We prayed for over a year and networked with many pastors in our association for assistance, casting vision for declaring the unique area as a mission area, not a normal American city situation. God truly opened doors for the largest church in our association to offer to bring in an outreach team to assist us. This was an answer to prayer and would serve as a pilot for future churches to come alongside this church plant. When we recently presented it to the congregation, coupled with plans to push forward into outreach - through loving and serving the community, we realized that even our leaders were not behind us. They chose to resist and complained instead.
We were tired, worn out, spent all of our money to make this move a year ago..and realized that for once, we were with a small church that opted to remain small (less than 20) and that wanted to remain focused inward. The result? We sought counsel from pastors over us, and we resigned.
In some cases, its not the pastors who refuse growth, but the ingrown nature of congregations who have forgotten that their primary reason for existing (that is, the primary reason for the church to exist) is for the world.
For pastors of small churches, we encourage you to seek partnership with other churches in your area or your denomination, and to press your congregation towards loving and serving the community through many small acts of kindnesses. By serving together, your church itself will grow closer to each other and to the Lord, and, in time you will reap a harvest if you do not faint in well doing.
We are now seeking the Lord for what He has for us and pray the best for this tiny church.
By the way, we came from a mega church - and have seen the beauty in all sizes of congregations. Be of good cheer, pastors - and please keep on doing and preaching what God has given you to do.
I hope this encourages the weary pastors and their wives and families.
Posted by: Mari | Dec 12, 2005 9:51:37 AM
Comment on Andy's question...criticism vs. discernment. If someone wishes to "speak the truth in love" they will speak it directly to you. If it wasn't addressed to you, dismiss it. If it IS addressed to you, take it to your prayer closet. Be open. Be willing. Listen for God's correction and then move forward.
Posted by: TClark | Dec 12, 2005 10:02:03 AM
I like Warren's conclusion - just do what God has called you to do. But,I'm not sure who "they" are. So, it is hard to know if ignoring "them" is good or bad advice. Is it other pastors? Is it congregation members? Is it popluar media (Christian and secular)? Do "they" know me and my ministry well? Who is Warren talking about?
At the same time, sometimes God uses "them" to build us up or point out an area of needed growth. Doing what God has called us to do as pastors sometimes requires we listen to "them". As iron sharpens iron...
The danger in what Warren says (indeed in what anyone who speakes publically says) is that it can be misunderstood and misapplied. I don't think Rick Warren would say he is closed off to the opinions of others. I don't know Rick personally, but my quess is there are many voices that speak into his life. His recent confession involving the AIDS/HIV situation in Africa is case in point. However, I have witnessed many pastors, in need of correction, responding to that correction by saying, "Well, I am going to do what God has called me to do." In their case advice like Warren's can enable denial about much need growth areas.
My two cents,
pastor michael
Posted by: Michael | Dec 12, 2005 10:11:04 AM
Great issue. With a few minor exceptions, large churches started off as small, grew and then are "large." In my studies of such churches, it was a combination of pastor, leaders, and committed people [plus a large dose of the Holy Spirit].
Yet, I have been in meetings when I felt two inches tall. The comments from big and growing churches directed towards small church pastors tend to range from dismissive to downright paternalistic in the negative way.
I left a local ministerium because of such attitudes.
As far as approaching other churches for help, I have tried it. It rarely works. One church asked that we disband, join their church, and sell our property (they were looking for a cash cow). In ten years, I have one church in our association that has partnered with us which reflects poorly on the Southern Baptist's claim to be in "partnership" - and that's all it is a claim without any substance.
I have learned to choose my friends wisely in the ministry. When large and growing church pastors dismiss me, I vote with my feet and knock the dust off. Jesus and I have more important things to do.
Just my two cents worth.
Posted by: Dan Moore | Dec 12, 2005 10:38:15 AM
Seeker sensitive vs traditional is the ....
(Only kidding)
Posted by: Pastor Bill | Dec 12, 2005 10:44:52 AM
Those attitudes are certainly telling. If ministry leaders dismiss small churches, criticize growing churches and resent large chrurches, what is left?
I am the pastor of a small church. I have friends in ministry in all three categories. I've been blessed with good relations, and have even been able to use our church to help others churches with larger and growing congregations.
Still, I find myself skeptical when visiting very large churches. In my case I believe it has more to do with my background than anything. I've never been a member of a "mega-church." I have to force myself to be open to what is going on there. Fortunately, I am better able to do that than before.
Posted by: Rev. Scott D. Hughey | Dec 12, 2005 10:46:41 AM
I have worked in 3 different churches these last 21 years as a youth, children and singles pastor. One church was small 100, the second was medium sized 250 the last one was 1,200. They all were effective as long as they kept their eyes on each person that came across their path as a ministry opportunity. People not programs make an effective church, period. I know, I have done it all.
Posted by: Rick | Dec 12, 2005 11:02:42 AM
I thnik that one reason for these reactions is that we are products of our society. It took years for me to move beyond the measure of success that I was taught through my education - you know the three Bs - Buildings, Baptisms and Budget. I pastor a small church that is growing and just broke the 100 member mark by using tools for both small churches and much of what Rick uses. We have helped smaller churches and accepted assistance from larger churches.
In the end how we relate to one another really shows how we relate to God. Hopefully we are more focused on our relationship with God and ho wwe can improve that than on how we are better or worse than another - in the end we all come up short if we do the comparison game.
Posted by: Greg | Dec 12, 2005 11:19:43 AM
As a pastor of a redeveloping church (I never use the word small), we are often ignored not only by larger churches or city agencies. This can cause many church members pastors included feel that they are constantly hitting a brick wall when it comes to the work of God. I've found out that the soil in the vineyard is often very hard on the surface our job is to keep working the soil to plant the seed. It will grow. Are job as a small church is to work the soil.
Posted by: Charles A. Woodridge | Dec 12, 2005 11:31:45 AM
Great article
The heart beat of our Christian country is the small church! (Over 90% are small)
The voice of our Christian country is the Large (Mega) church (less than 2%).
The most "shot at" in our Christian country is the Growing Church. 3-5% These pastors are targets for the disgrunteled church goer and the occassional pastor who really wants to be a growing church (sad).
The most harmfull in our Christian Country is the non-Biblical church. (growing in great numbers at an alarming rate) Wesley, Calvin, Luther etc are probably in the background saying, "how can they do this to the foundation we have laid. You know them and God will take care of them.
The small (church 15 to 75 members)are everywhere in our country, and these pastors get very little attention, and have a very small voice. Some of the greatest sermons and greatest leaders are here in these churches and they have learned how to deal with the problems that plague their community. You never hear them and very rarely see them because they have no time to write books or be on TV, because they are in the trenches. Would they like to do those things -- probably so, but it is not on their agenda. Many (not all) of these pastors aspire to be MEGA church pastors but know they have to settle in to the problems John and Mary Jones have as they pour their lives into the community.
The Mega Church Pastor (many great leaders) have been gifted with the ability to lead large numbers and to train a large staff. Most all the "small church" pastors do not have this giftedness from God and recognize that as they go. These Mega pastors get to ride the wave and most are blessed knowing their growth and ability came from the Lord. I can think of a great number of mega Church Pastors that know they are blessed of God to do what they do. The ones to look out for are the MEGA church pastors who walk the wall on major sin issues and have pleasing ear tickling messages that never cuts deep into the sinners heart. God will deal with these pastors as he will deal with me and you.
Sometimes these pastors get taken away with their success and look at themselves as the "great Christian hope." They have time to write more books, and their voice is getting louder. There is a mixture of good and bad here and it takes much discernment to weed out the bad.
Where do we sit in the scheme of things today? Do we focus our giftedness on the Gift Giver? Are we content, as Paul writes being content in all things, knowing God has us in the right place at the right time?
Do we have time to shoot at the small, medium, or large Mega Church Pastor and point out his every mistake. Do we sit in the PEWS looking for things that are wrong, or do we take what is right and dwell on those things?
Do we look at "MEGA" church pastors and try to tear them apart because they are "mega Church pastors?" Do we look at the "Local small church pastor" thinking that he has little to say because he has little in attendance? Do we try to find fault in our leg because we are a hand? I have come to realize that the small toe nail on my left foot is there for a purpose and although I give my hair much more attention, they are all part of the same body.
I can't say ignore them, because that may cause you much greater pain. Know why they do what they do and -- PRAY FOR THEM -- I think this is what Jesus would do!
Blessings
Posted by: Pastor Bill | Dec 12, 2005 11:39:45 AM
We miss the point, if Isaiah was preaching the truth, "the prince of peace" it has to start with church leaders (who are still firstly Christians) who surrender to God and live a life of inner peace. Thsi is in transistion to the church living in peace followed by communities, cities, states and nations of peace. Until we "Christians live in a way of peace" and stop gossip and back-biting this will continue.
Posted by: Terry | Dec 12, 2005 12:16:12 PM
